What type of dog is best breed ?

[madmac]

Now I ask this question because alot of you guys have dogs. But I'm starting to think on getting one. I've had lots of dogs in my life but never a bird/hunting dog.

What would be the best all round dog.

IE: Black Lab.
Cho. Lab.
Golden Retriever.
Pointer.
Nova Scotia Duck Tolling Retriever, etc.

Or get a mix breed, not registered.

Honest opinion guys.
Cheers !!

[castbullit]

Depeds on what you want to do.

All-round bird dog (waterfowl and upland), can't much beat a lab. As for colour, there is much debate, which I won't start here (all different colours belong to this sight via their bosses).

Chesepekes for pure waterfowling, especially late season ( i know one that made a 15 min water retrieve in the Atlantic off Nfld in Jan, and kept on hunting). However, if you have small children or the nieghbours do, they can be a one man dog, much like a German Shepard.

Goldens are real nice house /family dogs and good upland and duck dogs. However, they have been overbred in a lot of places, be careful on breeders. They are also usually a soft touch. My dad's dog looks like she was kicked in the arse if you raise your voice.

For all purebreds, look for hunting stock pref with some titles in theline. Won't guarentee anything, beuts gives you a much better chance of getting a good gun dog (worked for my new lab). There are breeders out there who are breeding for show, not gun work, and some just for numbers (Goldens are a good example, popular house pet, so be careful.

On the other hand, my ol' dog is 3/4 black lab, 1/4 husky. Paid about $100. Has some bizarre hunting traits, but never let a cripple get away in all of her 9 yrs, flushes upland, can spot ducks in the air at 3/4 to 1 mile, and until this year (having some health issues) would make water retrieves in 3 ft or meaner seas. She has a natural ability to calculate wind/tide drift ans swim to an intercept point, rather than chasing it downwind.

Me, I go with a black lab. Labs are proven game getters, and there a number of field dog breeders in driving distance for most places south of the tree line. Aslo, I hunt upland as much as ducks, so I like the versatility of the lab. That said, I might try a chezzie for the next dog, but that 4-6 years away (starting with my current youngster, I have started buying a new dog when the ol' dog is 6-8 yrs old. Gives you a trained dog to work with when getting the new one started, and I hope will take a bit of sting out of retiring the veteran). I thought about curly coat retrievers, but there are no breeders even remotely close (the one in Yarmouth gave it up). I've hunted with all colours of lab, duck tollers and goldens. I would hunt with any of them.

My 2 1/2 cents worth.

cb

Quote - You can ask a golden, you can order a lab, but you have to negotiate with a chesapeake.

[crockett]

BeausDad and I are shocked and deeply offended that you did not include Yellow Lab on your list of possibilities! The responses to this are endless. I am only 2 years into my first ever hunting dog. She's a yellow lab, and very versatile. She responds well to reward-based training (and also to discipline of course) and is a great pet/house dog (not sure how much that matters to you). Great with kids and strangers - useless guard dog if someone were to break in. She works around the house "Bring it to Mum" etc... and is an unbeatable chick magnet (I'm only half kidding about that). She was never gun shy, but I took steps to expose her to lots of stuff as a pup. One thing to note - she gets TWO HOURS of exercise a day (not just walks- running/fetching/hiking/hunting etc...). I know two of her littermates' owners who work long hours and try to get by on a few short walks a day (and no hunting) and they have real monster of a dog on their hands - wrecking stuff, chewing, barking, and other nasty ways that pent-up labs burn energy. Anyhow - hunting-wise she needed no training for water retrieves except for handling and obedience (get in the blind, stay etc...). For upland she doesn't point, but with work she stays within gun range and flushes lots of pheasants and grouse. The retrieves come naturally, and she seems to have a bionic nose. She pushes rabbits out of cover but is hard to call off them to get a safe shot (so far - she's only two). If you go the purebred route (any breed) TAKE EXTRA CARE SELECTING A BREEDER. This can save you THOUSANDS of and a lot of heartache - I've seen it happen. Any questions post again and I'll give you honest experiences. I gotta run to the dog park now - little bitch is giving me the stare!
Crockett
PS- Getting a "hunting pet" was the best thing I've ever done, but don't tell that to the wife, as you'll likely get a wedding album in the side of the head!

[madmac]

Guy's,

Did not mean to offend towards yellow lab's . I was just asking about any type of dog and the good folks Ideas on the subject. I could of listed 15 dogs, but I thought everyone would catch my drift. But your input on breeders and the yellow was great.
I know of one breeder who is very good. But the dogs are 800 to 1000.
I'm not sure on that kind of a price tag. I just bought a set of waders... ( didn't tell the wife yet )

Now I do find what I'm reading so far of great intrest. There is alot of factors to take into account.

Castbullit, thank's for you input, it opend my eyes on some of the styles and working abilitys of the dogs.

Any how, I look forward in reading more ideas and thoughts on this subject.

Thanks !

[chezz]

I love my Chocolate lab...nuff said!!!

BTW..he's not papered and cost me $350.00 with all shots included and a personal guarantee against health problems..
His trainer was lazy (ME)..
Thank God he had great natural instincts and abilities!!!Lol!!!

But he gets the job done!!!

[Lloyd]

man does this post ever bring back memories...lol. you dont have to pay anywhere around $1000.00 for a lab. but if you want papers and all that stuff then they can get up there. if you want a good hunting dog lab or not, just keep looking and asking there will be someone that will have a contact. by the way. when i asked this question more than a year ago i was almost burned at the stake... i ended up with a great little yellow female. probably the best dog i've ever owned. i've owned a few. great family dog, great hunter, great hoover, great licker, great very spoiled member of the family. yep labs are worth the strong feelings that you'll get. the single biggest thing about any breed of dog is the time that you commit to training the animal. but with a lab (type) dog the instincts are there they just need to be developed.
PS. stay away from show stock.

hey Ed are you still looking to sow Beaus oats, surly there's some one out there with a cute female. i kinda wish Bailey wasn't fixed.

[crockett]

Hey Madmac - I was just kidding ya' - no offence taken at all about the yellow labs! There will always be about as many different opinions as there are site members - but the good thing about this site (compared to some others) is that members seem pretty content to "agree to disagree" if need be without getting silly about it. As I said, I've only had one dog of my own, although I grew up with mutts (that I did not hunt with at all). Two and a half years ago I was in the same position as you. I saw some nice "non-papered" labs for 250 to 350 dollars, but was still working on convinceing the wife, who wanted to just get a pup from the pound, so I missed out on them. I don't want to get into listing examples of people I know who got labs from backyard breeders and ended up with all kinds of problems, because there are just as many examples of people who have had great healthy hunters and pets out of these arrangements. By the same token, others have gotten papered dogs from lousy "professional" breeders and ended up with all kinds of problems. However, I will throw some numbers out there to you about the costs of some of these problems that have happened to three buddies of mine - something to compare to the difference between a 300$ and 1000$ lab:
-2 x elbow dispaysia at age 3 = 6000$ - as a result the dog didn't get the surgery, and both dog and owner are suffering through another 5-10 years of discomfort and no fun (hiking/hunting etc...)
-another buddy has put 5000 into his golden's eyes, but it's now pretty much blind and mostly housebound at 2 years old.
-allergies = constant scratching and vomiting unless given medication and premium food = hundreds of dollars a year.
My point is, when I looked at these expensive and unpleasant possibilities I decided that the 400$ extra for the initial cost of the dog was a small price to pay to diminish the possibility of this happening (Ruby cost me 700$). What my vet says is "A cheap dog can end up costing you the most money". Also, I put much more value in a strong track record than on a guarantee. I have heard of breeders who are happy to hand over a new dog if the one you get is lame, but that doesn't help you that much - you still have an expensive crippled dog that breaks your heart every day, as well as another gamble with a dog from the same breeder. Anyhow - that's my two cents (ok, maybe 5 cents) worth on the matter. Believe me - I was facing EXACTLY the decision that you are facing and thought and talked long and hard about it with lots of different people. If I was going to go with a backyard breeder I'd try to get something that's a mix of two hunting breeds. My buddy out west adopted a golden/lab cross - it is a wonderful pet and phenomenal hunter - it even points!. However, someone else tried the same with a toller/lab cross and it's a nightmare of a dog (but healthy!).

[justducky]

well my turn to chime in on this a little,first off a Lab is a Lab no matter the colour,seen good,great,and bad of them all.
Goldens,well the only goldens ive ever seen were all what youd class as either show dogs or just good family pets,now i know there are some hunting goldens still around...just few and far between
Chessies Ive only ever been around 2 both were great hunting dogs but not real sociable...actually both were down right mean to anyone other then the owner "personaly not my idea of a dog id want around with kids"but man would those dogs get ducks
Any ways Im a lab guy always will be like a great house pet and great hunter...Im not convinced yet that any dog is worth $1000 as a pup "fully trained yeah ok"
I own two labs and have had 2 litters of pups so far and have been luck enough to be able to keep track of a lot of them,most have become great family pets some"non hunting familys"and a few have gone to shine in the duck gettn'trade.A couple of the members on here can atest to that.
any ways those $300 "backyard"breeders can be ok mind you some arnt but if you be careful you can get a good dog at a fair price and then the final out come of any dog weither it be $300 or $3000 all depends on you and the amount of time you put into it

[castbullit]

Having hunted with them (the dog and Chezz), I can atest to Timber being a great duck getter, incl a 1 1/2 hour old blind retrieve on a duck that swam into some grass a died - came up with the tide.

There is a British breeder's saying about labs -

American train dogs, Brits breed them. (Don't know what the author thought about us Canucks)

All that to say natural ability and instinct go a long way.

cb

[crockett]

Here's something to stir the pot, but I've also hunted water and field with folks who have two other breeds - a German Shorthair Pointer and a Portuguese Waterdog. I don't know anything about the breeds, but both were pretty good, especially the GSP. The waterdog was friendlier, but totally crazy. The GSP was beautiful and friendly enough, but all business. He retrieved ducks willingly enough, but he took some coaxing in the cold water, unlike most labs. For upland though he was quite amazing. The labs you have your hands full keeping them within range when they get on a hot scent, and as a result you have to make generally longer shots and walk faster or whistle yourself to death. WIth the GSP, although he was not all that highly trained, it was neat to see him snap into a big bold point. We were able to get into nice shooting position before I went in to flush the birds (I was not a licensed NS hunter at the time of either one of these hunts). Anyways, something to look into. I wasn't that impressed with the waterdog, but with more trainign they might be good. What I DID like is that they don't shed like a lab - which can be a real pain if you're looking for a house dog. Personally, I don't care that much but you know how it is - if the wife cares you end up caring by extension, if for no other reason that having to endure the bitching! lol.

[crockett]

Scratch the PWD - I must be mistaken on the breed, the dog I recall looks nothing like the ridiculous-looking animals on the web! It looked more like a tall spaniel with a wiry coat that I remeber the guy telling me was non-shedding hair, not regular dog fur. Anyone know what it might have been? Perhaps it was a PWD mixed with something with shorter hair or something like that...

[Anthony]

What is wrong with show stock?

I don't think Orion had any problems with his "show stock", his instincts are great,now on some training aspects yes he definitely needs work on casting.

Just because he is slow isn't bad either. Safety wise I think I prefer his speed over a faster dog.

On breeds, I have seen quite a few breeds work. Chessies are fearless, determined but very protective of everything and can be aggressive. Golden's are sweet and only want to please, but the hair can be quite a mess from coming from the swamp. Labs are good all round dogs, Orion is great around kids and other animals and wouldn't hurt a fly but he may help carry the TV to the robbers truck. They are very versatile at hunting and are great companions. They are very smart but can be very stubborn at times. There is a reason they are the breed of choice for service dogs.

Just my opinion

[swd]

i have a mixed dog she is a little river /golden retriever this is my 2nd dog like this the first one i had for 9 years and was an excellent hunting dog and also an excellent house pet . the dog i have now is 9 years old and i am planning on haveing her bread the next time she goes in heat .you could not ask for a better dog . she stays by your side and in the duck blind she stays put until you tell her to go get the bird (unlike alot that jump out at the sound of a shotgun going off) she also comes in the woods when i bring deer apples out she comes so far then she lays down in the path and waits until i come back . when sneaking on ducks she responds to sign language i point when i want her to stay , tap on my leg when i want her to come . what this all adds up to is a medium sized calm dog that is easy to train and loves to retrieve .
now about labs , i personally have not had the chance to train one myself but i know a guy that has one that is good for only finding ducks in the marsh grass . it only retrieves when it wants to . it was advertized as a hunting dog but was more like a show dog and it was expensive . i know of 2 more chocolate labs (all have different parents) the two of them cant sit still long enough . we brought one the opening day this year , he had to be tied to the seat , and the other one i see every sunday (inlaws) and he jumps so much the kids cant go near her ....but the labs are tough and fearless .i always wanted one but i have seen too many that are too hyper and that are stuburn. thats why i never got one... i know there are some members with excellent labs on here, i just personally havent had the pleasure to hunt with one that was any good .......
a dog is only as good as its trainer.. the dog has to have hunting instincts in it to be a good hunting dog . there are too many breaders out to make money and dont care and will tell you they are hunting stock if thats what you want to hear ......thats why i would only get a dog from someone that i know has a dog that hunts ......

[Lloyd]

absolutely nothing is wrong with show stock, but, a field dog will have been bread to have those instincts brought out in successive generations that make it a better hunting dog. that is the purpose of the selective breeding. a show dog will have the characteristics breed into it that make it a show dog. both will share common genes but they are bread for different purposes. yes they can do both. for the purposes of a hunting dog the training, drive, enthusiasm for the hunt should be stronger and easier to develop. thats all i meant. i have heard that "the next dog that i own will be from hunting stock" that's not to say that there is anything wrong, just that there is a difference.
i am happy to hunt next to Orion and enjoy every minute of it. he is a great dog that does the job just fine. jeeessshhh dont be so touchy.lol
this lab topic is a great way to get some fellas wound up. did the same thing over a year ago.

www.fortheloveoflabradors.com/BreedStandard.html
www.smithfarmslabradors.com/

they differentiate in the these site for a reason.

[chezz]

Honestly guys..from what I've read here so far...No breed is perfect from the sounds of it..

It all seems to boil down to a few key points..

1) the dog comes from a good breeder (including the back yard guy) and not a puppy factory

2) "luck" with getting a dog with good instincts (makes life easier on you)

3) Spend lots of time with the dog training it to get what you want out of them

These seem to be the main points mentioned here so far..